Four Horsemen Studios Mythic Legions

But as far as character homages go, I dunno.

My favorite Savage crucible figure is Battle Cat, but he's a lizard. That's the only reason I bought it. It's the only reason I even took an interest in their line. Do I drop them for their homages?

I could. I think that would be an interesting conversation in this community.
 
I think homages are fine, but I think people need to understand that an homage doesn’t mean straight up doing it.

We also shouldn’t be mad at companies enforcing their IP.

I’m a fan of the Red Shadows and Adventure Team, so I’m buying FMF’s Crimson Moon and Agents of Omega product, but I think hasbro is fully in the right to shut that shit down (and probably should have).
 
Yeah, I think this specific barbarian figure could have flown under the radar if you didn't highlight the redhead and you certainly didn't do the throne pose from one of those infamous Dynamite covers.

Highlight the black hair and then just show you've got options. Throw in different armor kits.

One of the boundaries I've always grappled with is, nobody is giving us Resident Evil merch. So if all these knockoff companies want to keep cranking out Apocalypse Crisis characters, I have the money to spend, it's Capcom that's not making the smart choice. But it is outright theft when you make one to one Claire and Jill. But ... They're the only ones doing it. But ...
 
thewyldman said:
It seems like a lot of people outside of here are blaming red Sonja and boss fight so no


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Yeah.. that tracks for fucking 4H fans.

altcunningham said:
I think... The duck thing actually soured me, for real, for real. Frfr.

If I have to hold Skynet and Brainiac and the prompters accountable as an artist, I gotta hold the flesh and blood accountable, too. I understand homages and IP skirting. But the duck story as presented is what got me.
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To be fair, I've been pointing out for years that the 4H outright steal artwork to base their designs on. Some of their weapon designs are 1:1 stolen from an artist who was a friend of mine for quite a while. Incredibly solid dude and I know for a FACT they didn't credit him or ask his permission to, again 1:1 copy his designs for their figures. And these aren't generic designs. These are like.. the very distinctive big Elven sword and some other things.
Some of their character designs are virtually 1:1 cribbed from places like DeviantArt, and at least two of their Cosmic Legions characters are ripped off from Pathfinder: Starfinder designs, as I recall. And other people have said similar things they noticed.

Not to mention the constant 'homages' that are 100% just IP theft. These guys are fucking thieves that have never seen an original idea that didn't think they should own a piece of. They fucking suck. But, they're the 4H. So as usual.. no one will really care and their toys will keep selling.

altcunningham said:
But as far as character homages go, I dunno.

My favorite Savage crucible figure is Battle Cat, but he's a lizard. That's the only reason I bought it. It's the only reason I even took an interest in their line. Do I drop them for their homages?

I could. I think that would be an interesting conversation in this community.
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I'd agree with wyldman on this; the reality is that there is a difference, even if it can be hazy, between homage and IP theft. I do think you've gotta look at both intent and frequency; two things the 4H fail the test on HARD.
Is the intent to basically recreate a character/thing as close as you can without getting sued? Are you doing it once for fun, or constantly?

We know the answer with the 4H. They basically just re-do every single character/thing with their in-house style, but it's still very obviously that thing. Man-E-Faces is just.. Man-E-Faces, but filtered through Cosmic Legions. And they didn't JUST do Man-E-Faces. They did basically every MOTU character. You can buy almost the entire primary MOTU roster as Mythic Legions/Cosmic Legions figures and you know EXACTLY what they are the second you look at it. And again, they do this CONSTANTLY.

Compare that with Boss Fight Studio. Did you know they have a Skeletor homage? It's not actually Skeletor, though. It's a green skeleton (complete skeleton - not a skull on a muscle body) wearing purple Greek armor, and the shield has the 'spirit of Grayskull' on it. Amazing. It's its own unique thing, clearly a love-letter, but doesn't take the PLACE of that character in a display because it's still very unique and different. And they did that one time. They didn't release a 'MOTU homage figure' in every wave.

Savage Crucible used a distinctive color scheme on a VERY DIFFERENT concept for a character in order to evoke something you like without stepping on it or trying to 'get really close without getting sued.' It's literally a lizard guy but in a color scheme that makes you do the Leo pointing at the TV meme. THAT is a good homage.
 
Oh my god, I actually just went and read the 4H presser for the change to their 'not Red Sonja' figure and it was the most insincere, dishonest, slimy bullshit I've ever seen come from the 4H. Fucking gross.
 
Had a whole rant about how fucked IP law is and how we have, as buyers, created a reward system for toy companies to create homages to keep the lights on and fund their other projects, but we've rehashed this discussion like a hundred times already. Reward original creativity, I guess. Also indie toy studios are a fucking morass of questionable ethics. The business feels filthy if you lift the rock up high enough. Not defending 4H because they continue to be absolute dipshits but there really is an ecosystem where you need to do homages to get buyers to pay attention to you. (4H should be far, far, far past that by now though, that's rookie shit. But I say this with not-Cobra-Commander in my BBTS cart, with a not-Beast-Man on my bookshelf, with a not-John Carter/He-Man behind me on another shelf... I'm the problem it's me as the philosopher Tayloricus Swiftus once said.)
 
I know his designs can be a bit bland to some and he kinda did it at the beginning (though legally!), but I do commend Vala for not really going that route with his stuff and calling it out a bit.


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Is there a pattern where the "homages" are for properties owned by other toy companies? I tend to not notice them as I think they are more connected to lines I didn't collect (GI Joe, Master of the Universe) based on the comments. But I assume no one is trying to do "homages" for Disney or Warner Bros IP...they have a deeper bench of lawyers for that stuff...
 
Kinda, but generally for the products like those they tend to be things like Ramen Toy’s “Aces or Aviation” (top gun) or they’re just handled by Chinese companies making Mezco style figures.


For Warner Bros or Paramount, most of their brands that appeal to toy collectors are already being made by toy companies like DC


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The other thing is it's an homage til the guy with the bigger legal budget decides it's not. I kinda wonder if MOTU does big numbers at the box office this year whether Mattel will decide to be more like Disney or Paramount. If Mattel got hardass about it there'd be some scrambling across the industry.

(The one C&D that makes me laugh years after it happened actually happened to a friend of mine - he made tee shirts "It's Janeway or the Highway" and Paramount sent him a C&D and he's like did they really trademark Janeway? They did not, but that doesn't matter if PARAMOUNT threatens to sue you.)

There was a big hullabaloo in publishing last week because all the big IPs getting made into movies right now are books that were fan fiction with the serial numbers scratched off and of course people were like "AO3 should run ads so fan fic writers can make money!" Where the only reason AO3 remains in existence is that they have STUDIOUSLY avoided monetization. I honestly don't know how those books got published with fake Adam Driver on the cover but hey, they made more money than did on my books so what do I know.

Feels like it shouldn't be necessary but everybody feels like they have to. I mean, WTF is this?
 
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