CREATIVE BEAST STUDIOS Beasts of the Meso/Ceno/Cyberzoic

I'd say most likely, but I wouldn't be surprised if it ends up in a future Cyberzoic Kickstarter rather than just put out in the online shop first.
 
cmoney said:
I'd say most likely, but I wouldn't be surprised if it ends up in a future Cyberzoic Kickstarter rather than just put out in the online shop first.
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Have they said (or intimated) that they were going back to Kickstarter again in the future? You'd think they'd want to do that as little as possible.
 
I feel like we could do more with the tail than just that one big ball&socket, like gimme a couple swappable options.
 
Damien said:
Have they said (or intimated) that they were going back to Kickstarter again in the future? You'd think they'd want to do that as little as possible.
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Fair question. I felt like he alway used to talk that way in passing (ie: "such-and-such is planned for the next Kickstarter"), but I'm not seeing any definitive evidence on a quick search.
 
cmoney said:
Fair question. I felt like he alway used to talk that way in passing (ie: "such-and-such is planned for the next Kickstarter"), but I'm not seeing any definitive evidence on a quick search.
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I mean, I'd probably try to back it, even if for just one or two smaller items like the wolf. It's just surprising to me whenever these creators do talk about, or actually follow through with, going back to Kickstarter just because of the cut KS gets. You'd think after being successful and having the established customers, you could just run pre-orders. Sort of a 'Kickstarter without Kickstarter' process.
 
Right, and they've been putting a lot of brand-new molds up for straight pre-order on the site since the last one. I know they just did a Kickstarter for a card game based on the Cyberzoic stuff, but I haven't even really heard anything about more product for that line since the last KS ended.
 
I'll have to keep an eye out, because I am totally cool with getting an armoured giant wolf.
 
Damien said:
I mean, I'd probably try to back it, even if for just one or two smaller items like the wolf. It's just surprising to me whenever these creators do talk about, or actually follow through with, going back to Kickstarter just because of the cut KS gets. You'd think after being successful and having the established customers, you could just run pre-orders. Sort of a 'Kickstarter without Kickstarter' process.
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On the other hand, if you take preorder money and the project fails people will expect and demand refunds, unlike KS.
 
adrienveidt said:
On the other hand, if you take preorder money and the project fails people will expect and demand refunds, unlike KS.
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I guess that depends on what you mean by 'fails.'

If a KS doesn't fund no one gives you any money anyway, which isn't functionally all that different from taking pre-orders and then issuing refunds if you don't get enough pre-orders.
If it's "we can do a KS, not deliver any product, and keep the money" then yeah, that's true. But also not something I see as a motivating factor with Silva as I don't think he's out to steal peoples' money.
 
Yeah I think Dave Silva has a pretty reputable track record. He’s been doing this now for over 10 years, he’s not out to steal people’s money. He’s as genuine as they come. I mean for god sakes the dude makes regular appearances at NJCC, Legions Con, Power Con and just as recently as this past summer he made his first appearance at G-Fest. If he were a scammer he wouldn’t show up to shows like this with his crew. And he provided weekly updates in a podcast and serves up newsletters on a bi-monthly basis. The guy is literally the face of his own product


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Damien said:
If a KS doesn't fund no one gives you any money anyway, which isn't functionally all that different from taking pre-orders and then issuing refunds if you don't get enough pre-orders.
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Most companies that take pre-orders are funding the new product's production with money earned from previous products; but Silva is quite unlikely to be making that much scratch, imho. So he's in the position of taking PO money to fund the production of the PO product, and if that production run fails he's out money he's already spent on failed product *and* has to refund it to the customers that won't get anything.
 
adrienveidt said:
Most companies that take pre-orders are funding the new product's production with money earned from previous products; but Silva is quite unlikely to be making that much scratch, imho. So he's in the position of taking PO money to fund the production of the PO product, and if that production run fails he's out money he's already spent on failed product *and* has to refund it to the customers that won't get anything.
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I understand that. What I'm saying is that it doesn't seem in keeping with who Silva presents himself as, nor with wanting a successful company, to -rely- on the idea that KS would allow him to basically just fuck customers out of their money and not be responsible for it. Because, realistically, that would probably be the end of Creative Beast Studios, right? So I have a difficult time imagining that as a consideration for him.
 
Which path *wouldn't* be the end of CBS? We know these toy production runs start at like $50,000US and if he takes that in, spends it on bad product the factory won't or can't re-run for free; then has to pay that back out; how does CBS stay afloat? I have no idea what his bank account looks like but none of these boutique toy companies look to be making multi-digit profit percentages to me.
 
I still think the argument here is basically 'would David Silva create a Kickstarter, at this stage in his company's life cycle, BECAUSE he knows he could write off the project and not have to pay anyone back, thereby burning every ounce of goodwill he's ever earned?'
I don't think so. I could absolutely be wrong. It just doesn't feel like a motivating factor to me. But I also don't know Silva personally and maybe he does think that way.
 
My understanding is that Marauder John, of Marauder Task Force; is a lawyer with some decent scratch in the bank. The first production run of the MTF Troopers got through the full production run and shipped Stateside only for them to find the hard joint plastic was brittle shit and it all had to be trashed. At that point, he paid out of his pocket to do it all again to ensure backers got their figures. He basically runs the company as a profit-neutral hobby and still does KS campaigns for whatever reason/s. It's not a 'how can I fuck the people over if need be' so much as a 'what's the path of least harm to us all if everything goes south' question, imho. If the company exists, it has options to do *something* for losing KS contributors but if he himself goes bankrupt with lawyer fees nobody gets nothing except the lawyers.
 
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