X-Men '97

[yojoebro82]

Speaking of claws, I had a set of metal Can of Beams claws sitting around for over a year that I've never used. I just put them in my Apocalypse wave Wolverine today for the first time......damn, it's like a whole new figure! My new Wolverine buying plans are all put on hold now.

 

[Enforcer]

I donno why they didn’t just use a torso like what Ka-Zar has. It’s right there. The Starting Lineup pecs look like droopy manboobs.

This may answer some questions we've had about re-use between lines. It appears they can resuse assets from discontinued lines without issue, and why we haven't seen anything cross between Legends and GI Joe Classified

 

[EnigmaticClarity]

The first appearance of his bone claws was in Wolverine #75 in 1993 after Magneto pulled all of the adamantium out of his body. At the time Logan didn't realize he had them because his memory of his full past had been gone since the 1970s when he went through the Experiment X process in the Weapon X program that gave him the adamantium.

That episode from the animated series was from season 5 and aired in 1997. If they showed him there without bone claws they either messed up or maybe the writer of the series just didn't like the bone claws and intentionally left them out.

Later in 2006 in the Origins comic series they showed him first discovering he had the claws as a pre-teen in 1845. They appeared out of his hands while he was fighting with Sabretooth's father Thomas Logan who had just killed his own father John Howlett. He then semi-accidentally killed Logan with the claws only to learn that he was actually his real father after he died. They reenacted that scene pretty closely at the start of the 2013 film Wolverine: Origins.

 

[Misfit]

Wolverine #75 left it open-ended if Wolverine ever knew he had those bone claws before the Weapon X program. It wasn't revealed that he did until the Origins series, so the cartoon was just following with the idea that he never utilized them (and the episode was based on an existing story where Wolverine fought with a pair of batons alongside Cap, they just changed them to claws probably because it seemed fun).

 

[NORM]

Also part of Wolvie’s healing factor is that it heals his mind of trauma and other memories. Isn’t that why he’s been an amnesiac? He may not have actually remembered he has claws despite retcons.

 

[TENIME]

Also part of Wolvie’s healing factor is that it heals his mind of trauma and other memories. Isn’t that why he’s been an amnesiac? He may not have actually remembered he has claws despite retcons.

Which makes perfect, scientific sense.

Unlike, say, an adamantium bullet?

 

[TheSameIdiot]

Later in 2006 in the Origins comic series they showed him first discovering he had the claws as a pre-teen in 1845. They appeared out of his hands while he was fighting with Sabretooth's father Thomas Logan who had just killed his own father John Howlett. He then semi-accidentally killed Logan with the claws only to learn that he was actually his real father after he died. They reenacted that scene pretty closely at the start of the 2013 film Wolverine: Origins.

I didn't read this story until well after seeing it in X-Men Origins: Wolverine. Did it sit with fans as badly as I've heard?

 

[Chooch555]

At the time? I don't recall pitchforks, but the internet wasn't a cesspool yet. There was palpable fear of movies calling the shots in the comics with costume changes and whatnot so the "we'll tell it our way first" held some water.

 

[raybot]

I read Origin as it was coming out in 2001/2002. It got top-billing as a game-changing series, but it was sort of an uneventful monthly so the regulars at my comic shop were kind of down on it. To me, Origin’s main problem was that it just ended up being totally unessential reading.

I think Marvel knew Origin and Origin II weren’t big hits so the 2006 Wolverine Origins series really focused on the WW1, WW2, and Cold War history that 90s fans were hoping for.

 

[RichardSimmonsRobot]

Also part of Wolvie’s healing factor is that it heals his mind of trauma and other memories. Isn’t that why he’s been an amnesiac? He may not have actually remembered he has claws despite retcons.

My understanding was that his "previous life" before the Weapon X program was essentially erased or blocked in his memory by the program itself. I'd never heard that his mind heals trauma, as Wolverine is one of the more heavily traumatized characters in the Marvel Universe, so he wouldn't be remembering much. Plus throughout the various 90s Wolverine / X-Men comics you see scenes from his past (mostly from Weapon X though also warzones prior to him getting picked up by them) bleeding into his memory and he isn't certain if they're true or not. Some come as horrific hallucinations, others seem more clear but he's not certain if they're implanted. His "inner work" with Xavier seemed to be not only based around regaining his dignity/humanity and becoming a better person, but also having his mind unlocked in some capacity as well.

 

[EnigmaticClarity]

Wolverine #75 left it open-ended if Wolverine ever knew he had those bone claws before the Weapon X program.

If he ever knew, yes, because he just had no idea about his past. But he immediately assumed he was born with them as shown in the page below from #75.

 

[EnigmaticClarity]

I read Origin as it was coming out in 2001/2002. It got top-billing as a game-changing series, but it was sort of an uneventful monthly so the regulars at my comic shop were kind of down on it. To me, Origin’s main problem was that it just ended up being totally unessential reading.

I think Marvel knew Origin and Origin II weren’t big hits so the 2006 Wolverine Origins series really focused on the WW1, WW2, and Cold War history that 90s fans were hoping for.

I've been confused for days about Origin vs Origins, so thanks for clearing that up. My memory told me the original was called Origin which I read when it came out, but I kept finding references to the 2006 Origins story and confused the two thinking I had just remembered the name wrong. Sounds like Origins is where the WW2 stuff is at so I'll check it out. I still have Origin in my basement, but I never read Origins.

Social media wasn't a thing when Origin came out, but people being obnoxious idiots was very much there if you knew where to look for it. I've been doing online forums since the Commodore 64 days with a modem in the 1980s, and when Origin released in 2001 yes, fans complained about it a LOT in online forums. I don't even remember why because I disagreed with it and enjoyed the story...people being overly-picky about minor shit that doesn't match their preconceptions blurs together over the years when you hear it about everything multiple times per day.

 

[Misfit]

If he ever knew, yes, because he just had no idea about his past. But he immediately assumed he was born with them as shown in the page below from #75.

It's exactly as I said. He knew he was born with them, but he doesn't know anything more than that. We're talking about retcons upon retcons upon retcons, it's why the animated series didn't jump to the conclusion that he knew he had claws and was actively using them. All of that came with Origins which was well after the fact. Plus the episode was a "Wolverine remembers," and he's an unreliable narrator, at best.

At the time? I don't recall pitchforks, but the internet wasn't a cesspool yet. There was palpable fear of movies calling the shots in the comics with costume changes and whatnot so the "we'll tell it our way first" held some water.

I remember it being kind of tepid. It was one of those things where the reality didn't outweigh the mystery. It was kind of less fun knowing everything about Wolverine, but I don't blame Marvel for finally doing it.

 

[EnigmaticClarity]

We're talking about retcons upon retcons upon retcons, it's why the animated series didn't jump to the conclusion that he knew he had claws and was actively using them.

If they had him holding ninja claws then they did jump to the opposite conclusion that he WASN'T born with bone claws. And I'm not surprised...the bone claws seemed stupid to me when they introduced them. I've seen far stupider stuff, but I remember not liking them for quite a while. I'm a bit more fine with them now mostly because I eventually realized we see even crazier things from evolution in nature such as the narwhal's tusk that somehow evolved from a tooth in its mouth to stick out of its head for up to 9 feet long...that's some crazy shit right there that Logan's claws can't even begin to match in terms of absurdity.

Either way the cartoons and movies frequently differ from the comics lore so it's not a big deal. What'll be interesting is whether or not they continue that in season 2 since we'll see what he's like without his adamantium.

 

[raybot]

Sounds like Origins is where the WW2 stuff is at so I'll check it out. I still have Origin in my basement, but I never read Origins.

Yea, Origins is more of an essential series. It introduced Daken and the overall plot device was that it happened after House of M when Wolverine’s real memories were restored so he kept flashing back to the past to deal with a present day loose end or answer some 90’s mystery. Kept Wolverine’s side quests out of the main title while fleshing out Wolverine’s timeline. Tons of guest stars, pretty good read, lots of reveals. Steve Dillon‘s interiors were a little uninspiring and there was some Romulus stuff though.

Origin suffered from being primarily set in a remote house in Canada in the 1830s. After 8 months of monthly reading, the overall payoff of knowing Wolverine was a plantation owner’s wimpy son, and that Logan had a lamer birth-name just didn’t land for me.